And I'm also tossing this JIRA out there, because it's a woefully under-noticed issue that I think needs more attention. While I have a problem with getting notifications at all in that corner, merchants have an entirely separate concern--that of notices, sent items, and sales events capping out and refusing to load past that point. If you merchant on SL, or if you're an estate owner, this proposed modification could be very helpful. Watch the issue in the hopes that the Lindens will--at some point--remember it exists and work to fix it.
|(from the bizarre album)|
Seen at American Bazaar: Just hanging around shopping nude. No big deal.
Also, the little pot-leaf mouthie kills me on this one. Why make one? Why buy one? I guess I just don't get the desire for it as an accessory thing.
|(from the bizarre album)|
I'm reasonably sure that she was wearing mesh clothing and mesh hair, and that the lower clothing--cut-off jean shorts, spandex leggings, baggy cargo pants, whatever it actually was--required am alpha layer under the mesh object. Right now, that's what Singularity seems to do--it doesn't show skewed toruses, spikes, or round untextured grey spheres piled haphazardly around the avatar...it just doesn't show anything, at all.
Also, more explanation behind today's rolling restart of the entire grid:
[16:24] Dxxxxx Cxxxxxxx: so the rolling restarts are because LL opened a TP exploit. seems griefers have been mass TPing people around the grid all day.
[16:25] Dxxxxx Cxxxxxxx: even doing it at Linden Office Hours, to lindens. The cheeky bastards.
[16:26] Dxxxxx Cxxxxxxx: has to do with llTeleportAgent() a new function being tested on some sims.
Here's what I want to know: why did the Lindens open this TP exploit? That bit's not well explained. How'ver, this is followed by conversational diversions. First, a question:
[16:46] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: how do you make a tiny prim?
[16:47] lxxxxxx Gxxxxx: Feed it very small numbers?
[16:47] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: Hee :)
That might have to make the profile. But this is what I meant to bring up:
[16:50] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: hello caledonians :-) anyone here good with setting perms, please?
[16:51] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: LL has apparently changed something, and i missed it
[16:52] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: now when you rezz a box it defaults to no copy, no mod, trans
[16:53] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: and the option to make it no trans is greyed out?
So, I admit, it's been a while since I built anything with an eye to initial details. Usually, I just rez a box (or more usually a sphere), and then muck about with it until it's the general size I need--then I get into details. I don't really fret about permissions until the object is done, and then I'll ponder what permissions to assign.
So I checked it to be sure, and yes, she's right. It rezzes out no copy/no mod/trans for the next owner. Which isn't my preference--I prefer copy/mod/no trans--but is still an acceptable default. And, as I recall, it's been the default for several years now.
[16:53] Txxx Rxxxx: You cannot have it "no everything". You need to enable one of the others.
[16:54] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: if i set it to mod ok the checkbox for trans is still greyed out
[16:54] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: it has to be copy OR trans. it cannot be neither.
Which is true. And as far as I can remember, it's been that way. It is possible, if one is modding existing prims--like the eternal Linden freebie whatevers that will likely circulate until the end of time--to get something that's copy/mod/trans as a true freebie, but...that's not usual, and it's hardly done anymore.
[16:55] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: if you want to restrict people passing it on after selling, No Trans is what you want, if you want people to be able to gift it, make it NO copy and Trans.
[16:55] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: so it won't let you change it to transfer is what you are saying, right Miss Axxxxxxx?
[16:56] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: why the hell did they do that????
Here's where I started getting confused. Granted, yes, this was a behavioral change from the former way prims were assigned permissions, but this was a behavioral change that's been on the ground for several years now...like, at least four, here. If not more. Where the hell has she been for four entire years?!?
[16:56] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: to prevent people losing items.
[16:56] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: if you want it no transfer, make it copy.
[16:57] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: all it means is that they will be able to have multiple copies themselves.
[16:57] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: if they keep dumbing things down so much we are going to have to hire 4 year olds to do tech support
Ah, but you're assuming the Lindens are actually hiring people. Tch. Biiiig assumption, there.
But also, why is changing that behavior "dumbing things down"? I don't get it. People to this day set permissions wrong and send things out, but this was actually one of the bigger innovations to prevent that. And guess what? It worked. Far fewer people send things out wrong, and it's not like it's hard in any way to check the boxes and make something trans and no copy, instead of copy and no trans.
[16:57] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: I'm reasonably certain that the perms system has always worked like this.
Yeah, *bzzzzzt!*, no, you'd be wrong there. But, as previously stated, it has been a while since the permissions set was changed. As I recall, this particular gentle entered the grid in either 2008 or 2009, which would have been after the permissions changed in the first place--so I'll toss partial credit (aka, if you've never experienced the system as it was before, then it's "always worked" like that).
[16:57] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: I think she is trying to make it transferable, and it just won't let her.
[16:57] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: what i want is no copy
[16:58] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: well if you want it no copy, make it trans first. then the copy box will stop being greyed out.
[16:58] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: i have been here 3+ years and it has not always been this way
[16:58] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: she says it still is gray
[16:59] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: funny I understand this..lol
[16:59] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: and if it's not something i'm going to sell or give away i should be able to set the perms any way i like
Again, *bzzzzzt!*, wrong. If it's not an existing full-perm free prim that's being modified? It's not going to be settable "any way you like". You have to pick which permissions you want. It's not a hard concept.
[17:00] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: it's my creation after all
[17:00] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: well if you're not going to sell it or give away, the perms don't matter - permissions only apply to the next owner.
Precisely. Hells, if you made the thing, you can set it however you want (within existing limitations); because none of those permissions will matter as long as it's in your inventory. You can even make it completely free, or pretty completely locked, if it's just going to sit in your inventory and gather pixelated dust. Setting permissions only matter to the next owner of the prim--the avatar you sell it to, or give it to, or whatever.
[17:00] Txxx Rxxxx: If you're not giving it to others, permissions don't matter anyway.
[17:00] Txxxxx Hxxxxxxxxx: Maybe I understand it because of all the mistakes I make :)
[17:00] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: yes they dom i don't want it copying, i don't want a copy left in inventory when i rezz it
[17:01] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: *do matter
So...what stops her from deleting the copy in inventory? It's what I do. One click, two at best, you're done. This is not rocket science.
[17:01] Txxx Rxxxx: No way you can do that with your own object. You can pass it to an alt to kick in "Next owner", and then back.
[17:01] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: Permissions are *next* owner permissions. they do not affect objects you've created in any way.
[17:02] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: (if you own them)
[17:02] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: yes they do, if they are set to copy a copy is left in your inventory when you rezz it
[17:02] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: and that's what i don't want
[17:02] Txxx Rxxxx: That is because you always have full perm on your own objects, no matter what permissions you set for "next owner".
Yeah. Because that's how the system works. Suck it up, sweetheart, it's not going to change.
[17:02] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: if they're set to no copy, the same thing applies, Miss Lxxxxx.
[17:03] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: no no no you don't understand
[17:03] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: I've developed a habit of 'rezz and delete' with stuff I've made.
[17:03] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: nevermind
[17:03] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: no copy items only become properly "no copy" when they get sent to a new owner.
Exactly. Also, "never mind" is two words. But I digress; she seemed to be getting cranky:
[17:03] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: nevermind
[17:03] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: you don't get it
[17:03] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: I do. You don't.
[17:04] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: *mutes* Sxxxx and closes window
[17:04] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: I wish I had arrived earlier in the conversation.
I doubt it would have created anything easier to comprehend.
[17:04] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: Happy to help.
[17:05] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: I don't think many people mute me, this is quite the achievement.
[17:06] Cxxxxxxxx Hxxxxxxx: You have arrived
[17:06] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx grins
[17:06] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: *chuckles* I refuse to let the classic permissions conversation be a drama. I came in too late to know the original item-need, or would have helped.
See, here's the problem. I was there, and I think most of us would be willing to help--but [Sxxxx] seemed to be doing so well. And then the inexplicable rage-quit moment. Or at least the mute-flounce moment. It's bizarre.
[17:06] Txxx Rxxxx: Axxxxxx wanted to make an object no-copy for herself so it wouldn't leave a copy in inventory when she rezzed it, and Sxxxx tried to explain that any permissions you change are for the *next* owner, not yourself.
[17:07] Txxx Rxxxx: Which resulted in a "LL changed it! I've been here 3 years. You are muted".
[17:07] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: Miss Lxxxxxx' profile states that she "Mutes first, asks questions later."
So, I admit I got curious. The bio of the argumentative lass in question:
ZENSo...I'm basically taking from this that she thinks she knows everything; she thinks other people don't know anything; she thinks she's friendly and pleasant; and she mutes on a whim. (Which is neither friendly, nor pleasant.)
# I mute first and ask questions later.
# A photograph, as we all know is not real at all. It's an illusion of reality. Hint: You are not a camera.
# DO NOT PRESENT YOURSELF AS AN EXPERT WHEN ALL YOU REALLY HAVE TO OFFER IS YOUR OPINION
# I'm only responsible for what I say, not for what you believe.
# All that being said, i'm friendly and pleasant if i am treated respectfully and courteously :-)
Oh, and inexplicably, she's "ZEN". What does that even mean? Especially with the trigger-happy muting.
Later, this happened:
[17:15] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: and there is a work-around by the way, simply drop something that's no mod no copy no trans into the contents *wink*
Okay, now she's just starting to irk me. Yes, sure, if you want to make something with zero permissions, for whatever crack-head idea you have in your wee brain--find that bizarre item hanging out in your inventory for no discernible reason, then yes--drop that in, and you now have a no-permissions item. Congratulations. Tomorrow, you can try drawing with crayons, it'll be fun!
[17:16] Sxxxx Sxxxxxxxx: If it's created by someone else, yes.
[17:16] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: Miss Lxxxxxx would do well to listen to various points of view - and that's a VERY good workaround.
[17:17] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: for a Builder, it's good to have a builder-alt handy, for various creation testing and kicking back and forth.
Or friends. Either work.
[17:17] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: there is ALWAYS a work around *wink*
Dear sweet suffering gods, stop with the winking. It just comes off as false and insincere and very, very superior. Right, you found a way around a problem no one else has, and you came back in to the conversation you'd flounced away from in high drama-mode, so you could show us all that we were so very very wrong! Yeah. Fine. We get it. Happy now?
[17:18] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: Life in SL IS A WORKAROUND. Face it. Why do we have baldy wigs? Workaround. Why do we have masking alphas for outfits? Workaround? Glitchpants? Should I go on?
[17:18] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: If we remain here past a year we are wise to the WorkAroundWorld.
[17:19] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: Precisely :-)))
It's not your grand solution, just so you know. You fixed a problem that was immaterial. Again, good for you. Do you want some macaroni bits to glue to something?
[17:21] Cxxxxx Wxxxxx: Second Life! Not for wimps!
[17:22] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: preeeeeeeeeeeeeecisley!
[17:22] Axxxxxxx Lxxxxxx: couldn't have said it better myself :-)
That's because you didn't say it. Honestly, I'm not saying she earned a mute for this, but in all seriousness, she's likely going to be ignored from now on out. What an idiotic waste of everyone's time.