Thursday, June 17, 2010

I mean cold, cold blood, running around inside our veins

[Late insert from the Editrix: one of the quoted participants in the Haven of Rogues/Haven of Mermaids discussion below has asked that her name be removed on the excerpted chat in this post; I have done so in compliance with her request.

[How'ver, I can't remove her name from Alexia Lennie's reply without killing her reply entirely, so at least that much of her identity must remain in this blog. That's not the frustrating bit, though.

[The reason this person asked me to remove her name is because Alexia Lennie was harassing her in SL. This is getting beyond ridiculous.]


===

This just in from Horrid Twine:

To My Lovely Friends, Colleagues, & Fellow Whales!

I have decided to pull entirely out of Second Life and instead move to InWorldz.
Every once in a while I leave and come back.
This time, unless something seriously changes at "The Lab", I will not be back.
Recent events have made me rethink being here.

And I find that InWorldz, though still small, is a medium that I can stand behind and be proud to do so.

So that is where Horribaubles and Pretty Squeezles will now be.

For those of you whom supported Zombiefest and the other assorted charities, I thank you.

In light of this, I am having a "closing" sale.


The closing sale is at her Starlust store--I think she's closed the others. Everything in her shop is L$100 until Saturday, at 8 am (she didn't mention her time zone, so I'd just think Saturday in general).

This leaves me asking a few questions that likely won't be answered:

1. Is Putrid Gloom leaving also? (That one, I think I'm asking Miss Putrid about, because I need to know if Show Me on the Doll is also leaving!)

2. InWorldz, near as I can tell, is using OpenSim architecture. Why go to Second Life Jr. if you're upset with Second Life? Sure, the management might be better, but seriously--the same damned coding issues we hate here? Are likely over there!

>3. What happens to the ZombiePopCarnival after Saturday?

If any of you need to contact me, you can find me @ horridtwine@gmail.com or on http://www.inworldz.com as Horrid Twine.

She will be missed, but if anyone wants to go over to inWorldz to say hi, feel free; she'll appreciate the support. Me, I adore her stuph, I do, but...I just can't register for a company who decided to end their corporate name in "Z". I just can't.

Other news: in the "Weekly Tempest", an in-world magazine for lovers of mer culture and fashion came this little tidbit:

HAVEN OF ROGUES/MERMAIDS RULE UPDATE

Griefers using child avatars have been creating problems for both 'Rouge' sims. These sims are adult, and thus, no child avatars are allowed.


They included a notecard listing--I thought--the exhaustive and heavy-handed covenant Matisse Vendetta developed on his land--which, again, is never mentioned to anyone on arrival, so the casual shopper or interested finned denizen has no clue they expect certain insane behaviors from the moment anyone enters either sim.

This was met with some startlement in the group of us that visited earlier this week:

[17:01] ******* ******: those assholes at haven of rogues
[17:01] Drakon Lameth: ?
[17:01] Jennifer Corbeau: ohhhh nuu
[17:01] ******* ******: have sent out info that we were griefing them
[17:01] Drakon Lameth: o.o
[17:01] ******* ******: to the mermaid weekly magazine


The Weekly Tempest mag, btw? Is not an in-house Haven of Rogues/Haven of Mermaids publications. It goes out to everyone who's bid in with a mermaid sim, or a mer fashion house, furnishings, or undersea plant life. In short, anyone who feels they have a tie to mer life, or wants to read more on it.

[17:01] Drakon Lameth shakes head
[17:01] ******* ******: HAVEN OF ROGUES/MERMAIDS RULE UPDATE

Griefers using child avatars have been creating problems for both 'Rouge' sims. These sims are adult, and thus, no child avatars are allowed.

[17:02] Emilly Orr: 0.0
[17:02] xvxRUBYxvx Praga: *blinks*
[17:02] xvxRUBYxvx Praga: Serenity is NOT a child avi
[17:02] ******* ******: and included a stupid notecard stating the rules
[17:02] Emilly Orr: THE HELL I AM A GRIEFER
[17:02] ******* ******: none of us were kid avies or griefers


Now, as I pointed out, Jakkar Carlos is heavily bish; so he looked young, but not CHILD young. And Saori wore a doll skin over her mer tail, so at best, she looked like a porcelain fantasy doll--again, not a child. I came as a small bunny, yes, but that bunny was short, not a babyfur, and Serenity was--Serenity! How does a six-foot white cat with tiny wings rate as a CHILD?!?

Apparently, on a mermaid sim, showing up in fur automatically labels one underage. The hell, people!

[17:02] Midori Yatsenko: where is this Mermaid Weekly Magazine?
[17:02] xvxRUBYxvx Praga: dear lord
[17:02] ******* ******: it doesnt name us but its talking about us
[17:04] xvxRUBYxvx Praga: if the sim is an adult sim...then they would be age verified to get on it
[17:04] ******* ******: after we were there
[17:04] xvxRUBYxvx Praga: *shakes head*
[17:04] ******* ******: and its not even adult, its just mature, so they are [lying]


So I gritted my teeth and pulled out the notecard they'd sent along. This is it:
NO CHILD AVATARS
Sunday, 13 Jun 2010 23:07:18 GMT
*******************************************
NEITHER OF THE HAVEN OF ROGUES REGIONS (that means
"Haven of Rogues" or "Haven of Mermaids) WILL ALLOW
CHILD AVATARS. None, period. There are bored folks
going around looking to create hate and discontent
by taking "child avatars" into mature and adult sims &
trying to start "crap." So! This fixes that potential for
"crap:" NO CHILD AVATARS. Get it? Got it? Good.
******************************************* M.V.


From Matisse Vendetta
....I am really starting to loathe that man.

1. We weren't bored, we were called there by friends

2. Our friends weren't bored, they were following advertisements that mentioned Lucky Chairs, groups they were in that mentioned changes in chair status, sales notices likely from your sim, Matisse--there could have been any number of legitimate reasons any one of us could have found your goddamned sim on our own! And this is what you tell people. This is what you think of potential customers in your sim, potential renters of your land. That we're griefers.

3. WE DID NOT SPREAD HATE. Honestly, where do you get this nonsense?

4. We did not "start crap". Some of us got there, ported by friends, and were immediately sent to the corner--and by that, I mean LITERALLY, sent to the CORNER COORDINATES of the sim into a SMALL CUBE OF STONE. This is not ejecting. This is not banning. If I were of less even temperment? I could AR your EMs for that!

But you are more than happy to live out the rest of your lives never seeing me again. TRUST me, I'm gone. Not one foot into anything you own; not one DIME spent on anything you've had a hand in making. I am DONE WITH THIS.

And I do believe that goes for Indigo Jashan and Alexia Lennie, as well. If that leaves me porting to mer places and having to check who made things, the full covenant of the land I'm on, who made the wall prims...so be it.

My gods, you're an idiot. Why on earth do you even have a shopping mall, open to the public, if you despise the public, Matisse?

I realize some questions have no answer, and less point, but it just galls me so. While I realize there is prejudice against non-humans (and in this case, non-mers), usually it's not so vibrantly painted, swollen with enraged revulsion, as this. We did nothing but come to investigate, to see if we wanted to come back later and shop.

Well, that answer's there at least--We don't want to. We never will.

28 comments:

samanthapoindexter said...

"InWorldz, near as I can tell, is using OpenSim architecture. Why go to Second Life Jr. if you're upset with Second Life? Sure, the management might be better, but seriously--the same damned coding issues we hate here? Are likely over there!"

I'm speaking for myself here, but my issues with the management at SL far outweigh my issues with the coding per se. The technology behind SL has gotten dramatically better over the past few years; it's the social/management stuff that's gone completely down the tubes.

Emilly Orr said...

True enough, upon reconsideration; and likely other virtual realms using the source code will be quicker to adopt things that people favor, like mesh imports, alpha blocking, and the like. And it won't be tied in with commercial-or-die mindsets, as Linden Labs seems to be.

Still. InWorldz. InWorldz. Zzzzzzz. They could have chosen a better name.

Rhianon Jameson said...

Miss Orr, don't tell me you're one of those bratz who have rulz about kreative spellingz of wordz. :)

I had the same reaction to the name. It seems to be designed to appeal to teenagers, bless their rigidly lockstep approach to anarchy.

Candy said...

OK, that's it. I'm TOTALLY going in my smallie avatar. I can't help it, Miss Orr. I think you've instilled some punk in me after all.

-Candy

Emilly Orr said...

Miss Jameson,

Sadly no--I have spelling oddities of my own I can't seem to ditch, and I have the distinction of having had more than one conversation with friends that was entirely comprised of "Dude".

But thinking that world is geared towards teens more than adults? Doesn't make me want to go there!

Emilly Orr said...

Now I have mad visions of punk Tinies...but see, that's another thing--Tiny avatars. I haven't seen one single Tiny avatar that made me think "Wau, the person on the other side of the screen must be nine."

I just don't GET it.

Horridess said...

Hello :)

I am posting here because I have before, and I like this blog. I read it often.

Let me first address the question of Putrid Gloom leaving. Putrid is not leaving, and is, in fact, redesigning her store. So she will be creating more wonderful and amazing things for all of you to wear. Putrid is my best friend, my sister, and I support her wanting to remain in Second Life.

As far as I go.. Here's the (maybe short) and sweet of it...

My problems with Second Life go back to the days of bank regulations. Amongst my issues with LL are the fact that they keep adding things like "voice morphing" instead of fixing existing problems that should be addressed. They have a history of this. Other issues have been regulating the "adults" to the "adult" grid and continuing to raise prices on land while taking away customer support. In summation, the negatives are starting to outweigh the positives.

The final straw was the restructuring. I am sorry, but firing that much of your staff, including and especially Harmony Linden was a mistake. She alone is an amazing person who kept a very tangible presence within the Second Life community. When I saw that she was fired.. something in my brain screamed, "Walk away now, because it does not get better from here."

I have left SL before, taking breaks every now and again. But until I see something change, I will not be back. This saddens me because I have a deep love for this world and it's people.

As far as InWorldz goes..

Yes, it can be considered an SL Junior. But there is a shift and a difference. The community is vibrant, full of hope and happiness. You can tell people are inspired to help shape this world into something that SL lacks now. The founders over at IW actually maintain a presence. The mentors are personable. People want to help each other.

How long will this last? Who knows. I know that SL started out this way. I know that in the beginning it's always like this. And I know that I want to be there to see if we can make this world better.

InWorldz may be just another OpenSim extension, but is the best alternative to Second Life that I have seen in a while.

Keep in mind, this is my post and my own soap box. Some of you may not agree, and that's a you problem. :) I still love all of my friends in SL and would hang them in my cupboard along with my mothballs any old day of the week.

Oh, and Zombiepopcorn isn't me.
Zombiefest was partly me. See Gattina Dumpling. She can help with ZFest. <3

Putrid Gloom said...

Ah! I finally found where to comment (forgive me for I am blonde)

Yes, I'm sad to see my Horrid leave, but she is happier in inworldz and although people associate us as being the conjoined twins of the SL horror genre, we are only joined at the mind, so no, I will not be leaving SL, but I will be EXPANDING into Inworldz with a new sim in a few weeks, although right now my store is closed in SL because I am building a new sim and updating all of my products, and making new ones and I hope you will all love Gloomy Creek (#2) as much as I love the vision of it.
To address a question 'Why go to SL Jr.?' the answer is simple from my point of view, complaining about SL without supporting an alternative can hold no real merit, and I certainly am not sure that the direction that SL is going in is condusive with what I had in mind for my user experience. In inworldz at least I can talk one on one with the founders and help shape that world at a fundamental level, and thats exciting. I can't speak for Horrid, although I often try, but I think she would tell you the same thing.
As for the Zombie Popcorn Carnival, although I am participating as a vendor (Horrid is not), the organisation and the event is nothing to do with us (we being Hot for Zombies/Zombiefest) Our organisation is completely focused on charity events and Zombie Popcorn is in no way affiliated with us and is not a charity event, but they are very nice.
I hope that clarifies some things, my mainstore and new sim will be opening this week, and Emilly we truly value your support and custom and I enjoy your blog.

Puti x

Emilly Orr said...

Miss Twine, Miss Gloom, lovely demented souls that you are--I did have Putrid's comments saved to post and respond to later, but am in the process of redownloading EVERYTHING onto a new hard drive, since mine went into severe shock and died of ennui, or something.

So I do have plans to get back to this, I am reading along! I'm just also loading the temporary drive in the system with the get-by things, then changing out EVERYTHING today, then waiting a few weeks and doing it all again, when we get a larger than 40 Gb drive. :p

But that is what happened--drivedeath pulled me out of building in world, turning in my time card this week, nearly prevented paying rent, much argh all around.

Rhianon Jameson said...

I simply cannot believe that your hard drive could die of boredom. Surely this blog alone provides it sufficient reason to live, not to mention the sheer number of links that I dare not click through at work. No, we'll have to look for a more sinister explanation.

Emilly Orr said...

You may be right. The likelier explanation is that it died from overwork. :)

Matisse Vendetta said...

Dearest Emilly:
Although your ejection (banned? I thought they just ejected you and your buddies -- which would explain being sent to the corner coords, that's what happens when you're ejected -- would you rather be sent to N.Korea? I can do that, maybe ... I'll check into it) may have been the impetus of my "notecard," it did not, specifically MENTION or even REFER to any of you, although it seems that you may have thought it did.

I was not present when poor Alexia was all besided by her poor lil self (quite the prude, you know, and not used to 'other than normal' avvies!) and apparrently made the decision to eject you. She must have just been confused by your confusing self ... who knows, like I said: I wasn't there. All Rogues can do that - freeze and eject people who bother them - it's part of the coolness of being a Rogue Outlaw in Haven of Rogues or Haven of Mermaids. :o)

Now, I also want to thank you for all the nice compliments (heavy handed, loathesome, etc., nice! I like it!) HOWEVER: As far as I know, a covenant (read: notecard with crap on it for you to look at) isn't to be dropped into your lap upon arrival in any sim (as many do). Personally, I find that rrrrrrrrrrrrrrreally annoying, so I don't drop 'em on ya for that very reason. The covenant is readily available in the ABOUT LAND tab up top ... always has been, always will be.

No, YOU were not being specifically addressed or even referred to, my dear, in my NoteCard to the SL Members of THORN and Rogue Outlaws, but YOU caused Alexia to make me aware of what CAN happen when a child avatar IS used to "start crap." Again: I APOLOGIZE if you inferred that I was implying "you" or your friends were using "child avatars" or "starting crap" (no matter what Alexia may have thought) ... and hey, mean ol' Indigo is just short tempered and intolerant, you should ALWAYS stay away from THAT mean ol' lady!) ... No, I was merely "made aware that the possibility exists" and I felt it necessary to PREEMPT that potential pain in the arse by setting that rule. :o) You and your friends are welcome to visit whenever you wish, as far as I'm concerned, if that's not POSSIBLE (or if you are turned into a pile of bones in a puddle of blood upon arrival in either of my sims) please let me know. I do NOT seek your lindens, whether it be from the sales of any "stuff," or from renting any abodes therein. My sims are there for you to look at and explore and then to tell someone else about because you thought they were cool (or to contact me and tell ME how cool you think they are) ... then I feel like I did my job well. Until a few days ago, EVERYONE who attempted to enter into "Haven of Mermaids" was literally blown up and turned into a pile of bones in a puddle of blood ... but now it's just those who blindly TP in (the setpoint is on top of a nuke. :o) ... so if you'd like to visit the new sim, I suggest you swim in from Haven of Rogues or ... well, you'll REALLY have a reason to loathe me.

Thanks for bloggin' about me ... even though we've never met, you sound like "Rogue material" to me ... don't know about "mer material," but you definitiely have the attitude of the Rogue Outlaws I originally formed some years ago, back in the days of Triskele when they banned MY ass for makin' fun of the sim owner (and now *I* do that! LOL!)

... Peace out. M.V.

Emilly Orr said...

Mr. Vendetta,

Any press is good press?

Thank you for thinking I'm Rogue material; you're likely right, as I tend to be the annoying sort that has wrecked friendships in the past because it was either stay friends, or be right. Guess which one I picked.

But see, the 'child avatar' thing bugs me...because none of us were. I know who was there, and the three people who were bounced, if not outright banned, were bounced because (in order):

* Her face was cute. SERIOUSLY. That's what made Alexia bounce Saori the first time: because HER AVATAR WAS CUTE. Cute does not equal CHILD.

* I came as a small bunny. Yes, that particular avatar is very short; I have shorter avatars, but that's not the point. I am fairly short as a human...ish...whatever the hell I happen to be at the time. That's not the point either. I was bounced; I asked why; I changed; I came back. I was irritated at having to change, but I did comply.

Oh, and while I didn't make a fuss over it, I am highly amused at the irony of the rant against "hun" on the friend in your picks? When Alexia said "thank you hun" when I went off to change.

* I will grant you, Jakkar Carlos is, on frequent occasion, a pain in the grid's collective ass. However, he was not in a child avatar. Did his avatar look young? Yes. Did it look like he was nine? Hell no. But he got bounced for it.

So when you say no child avatars, we have to wonder, what are you really saying? We need to show avatar ID if we ever come back? I mean, seriously, here. If ANY of us were wandering around your sims AS a three-year old or a six-year-old or even a ten-year-old ANYTHING...absolutely, bounce us.

But in all brutal honesty, the closest you got that day to "child" avatars? Was me in my bunny. This bunny, as it happens. Saori was in an adult av. Jakkar was in a young-looking av, but we're talking gay jailbait young, maybe sixteen to twenty young...not five.

So maybe my main question here is, what's your criteria for "child"?

Matisse Vendetta said...

Testing, testing ... hmmm ... I guess my REPLY/POST was too big? (That's what they ALL used to say) ... mebbe it's "under review?" ... hmmm ... Hello? Hello? Ziss thing on?

Matisse Vendetta said...

Test, test ... says my reply is over 4096 (I've reduced it to 4000, including spaces) ... test, test.

Matisse Vendetta said...

THEM: thought I would ask before i opened my mouth and offended someone -- Drakon Lameth came with his friend Lalinda Lovell - She told me that she would only spend her money where she was wanted, when i told her the sim was a topless one and Drakon had a child size cat thing avi, who wouldnt change the size. I booted him, im sorry. I wasnt going to argue with him, I asked him enough times –

Matisse Vendetta: The sim is topless EXCEPT for the commercial area(s); I know I wasn't there, but a "child sized cat thing" (?) doesn't sound like "a child." What we are doing is avoiding any idiot who wants to successfully place "children" in an adult/mature sim and scream "pornography," etc., and get my sim's axed from search and whatnot; or worse. Next time DO NOT ACT. Say what you like, WARN them, etc., give them a copy of the covenant ... and then copy/past to an NC and pass to me. I think you "boo boo'ed."

THEM: ok – sorry -- Mattise these guys are taking the piss



they had a friend here, Saori Nakamura avi for deffo -- i think they are doing it cause i bumped the other one

Matisse Vendetta: Child Avies: eject 'em. When the FIRST one comes back -- APOLOGIZE, girl. -- Here's where your subbie skills come in. Yes ma'am and no ma'am 'em all over the place. HOWEVER: CHILDREN <= CHILDREN get ejected after you ask them to leave in accordance with the covenant. :o) Hey, if they're coming back to mess w/you, look at it this way: you're helping boost traffic.

THEM: Jakkar Carlos is now a teenage boy avi, -- We have a problem here, in that, the avatars are measureing 6 foor odd, but are half size avis -- foor – foot -- but they are half the size of me and you, -- NWBSMBE has offered you 'Snapshot : Haven of Rogues & Mer Sanctuary, Haven of Rogues -- Log in to accept or decline the offer.

THEM: This lot are just bringing in Avatars -- Sir the first one was less than half size

Matisse Vendetta: CHILDREN ... CHILDREN ONLY. Midgets, dwarfs, halflings, other "short things" like little cat-things DON'T COUNT. Leave the short people alone .. CHILDREN ... Think "PORN." We don't want to get "busted" with kids and naked chicks.

THEM: yeh well we have one that keeps coming in and she is supposed to be a china dolll -- she looks like a kid MAttise -- Mattise its NOT a china dol its a kidd – its serious -- This lot are taking the piss -- you have two people here and both are kid avis -- and you have their mates who are arueing the tos

Matisse Vendetta: Take a photo, make a notecard of ALL conversation w/them ... Send it to me. CALL INDIGO for help w/the situation. -- Girl, you do NOT have the authority to eject "just because they piss you off." Indigo has the "just because they piss me off" power.

THEM has offered you 'Snapshot : Haven of Rogues & Mer Sanctuary, Haven of Rogues. Log in to accept or decline the offer. (x2) <= Pictures of you & yer perverts

Matisse Vendetta: What are the photos of, girl? And before you ask: you have permission to reply.

THEM: Saori Nakamura and Dakkar

Matisse Vendetta: Is there an accompanying notecard w/consersation transcript(s), girl?

THEM: the pains in the asses -- she put breats on to keep the child avi -- but imo she just looks like a developed 12 yr old -- the other one, Dakker has given me and indigo crapp -- ive not spoken to them since -- they are talking in voice tho -- or was about it -- shes just said sehs surprised she didnt get ejected for the way she oringally was -- for going back*

Matisse Vendetta: You need to get out of the store more, girl. Perhaps you should contact Tithis re: working for her in "Haven of Mermaids." I will change your title and your job description will change a bit. Would you like to work for Mistress String, girl? Change of pace?

Dassall I gots (after deleting a lot to keep under 4096 char!) Peace out, M.V.

Anonymous said...

As Alexia Lennie, I would like to comment.
Firstly, I am speaking of My OWN accord, unprompted and without the backing of the sim here.
this is MY opinion and mine only so do not hold the sim respnosible for what I am about to say here.

Dakkar came on in the first place causing problems and upset a customer. THIS I have not even mentioned to Mattise. Then, he started changing his avatar into everything BUT mer. This, was fine, but by then the person he had upset had gone.

Dakker changed into his "bish" characture

Dakkar maybe 'Bish" as you call it.
However, the appearence of a Bish, looks like an under age kid. The face, stature would quite easily be identified as a teenage boy around 14. I understand this is a Japanese thing, however, he did NOT have a Japense face to even pass and this sim is not a Japanese theme either.
You say Saori was a china doll? well, china dolls ususally do look like dolls not 3 year olds with blond bunches and a childs dress and less than half size. For a mature sim, neither of these are acceptable and this was explained.
The fact that Dakkar, Saori and a few of you chose to argue the matter did not help matters. If you are guests on a sim, you respect their rules end of.
Anything less is bad manners.

Dakker, and Saori were the only ones to be removed and only when they chose to wear the avatars which where unaceptable.
When Dakker changed to a monster, and saori a cat thing they where not NOT thrown off.

None of you where banned, not at the time, until you started argueing with the Indigo one of the sim bosses and after than, I have no idea.
Also I did NOT throw anyone else off; So that is a lie saying you where.

I have photos which, I hold of Dakker in the suppsoed Bish outfit, and Saori, if anyone wants to see them, they can, just ask me on SL.
Rabbits, sea mosters and the like I did NOT send away but, I am sorry, just because you don't feel that they are child avi's does not mean they aren't either - as I say people I have photos if you wish to make your own mind up.

IF our sim is so bad why am I still seeing people like Lalinda from your group coming on it?

When It was explained that the sim was a no top sim, one of you said well, I'll take my money where it's wanted. You then all preoceded to take the freebies.
The sim is a none top one, except the shopping area which is explain.

No doubt you will have anwers for all of this but, quite honestly, if the Lucky Kitty group ause as much trouble as this lot caused that night I feel sorry for where-ever they go.

Emilly Orr said...

Miss Horrid,

I, too, am sorry to see you go (and alas, computer breakdown prevented my popping by the Final Sale). But I do understand why you're leaving. And I understand why a lot of merchants have finally hit that "had it" point, and are moving to InWorldz, Blue Mars, or wherever else they find to set up there. It's frustrating and it's depressing to try to work within the system, time and time again, and be told that your money, your energy, and your time are worth nothing to the company you're spending your money, your time and your energy on; tier fees aren't cheap, advertising isn't cheap, importing textures into world for new products isn't cheap.

And what kills me every time is--this is visible. People sell off their sims and leave? That's going to show up. People abandon their sims and leave? That's going to show up faster.

And I'd honestly believe Philip Linden when he said the layoffs were just what they'd grown to; in other words, that 30% loss redefined them down to the starting size of the company two years ago, so they can focus on what "really matters"--the residents.

The problem with that? That 30% reduction didn't include many new hires.

I am sad to see you go, but I am glad that you hit that final straw when there was a viable alternative for you. That final Z bugs me, but...I may have to adapt and go check it out.

Emilly Orr said...

Miss Putrid,

I've loved every version of your sims you've had so far. And I know the difficulty of keeping and maintaining sims in this economy. I will say that sounds like a revolutionary concept: company representatives who actually want to talk to people. That's sheerly amazing.

I did go to Zombiefest too, and bought a few things I'd had my eyes on. I briefly confused the two; I'm better now. :)

Emilly Orr said...

Mr. Vendetta,

THEM: [...] when i told her the sim was a topless one and Drakon had a child size cat thing avi, who wouldnt change the size.

It's not a huge population in world, but there are some who prefer to present themselves as "ferals"; id est, four-legged animal avatars. These are rated as "child avatars", then? Also, if Alexie was telling people the entire sim was topless that would explain a large part of the problem.

Matisse Vendetta: [...] What we are doing is avoiding any idiot who wants to successfully place "children" in an adult/mature sim and scream "pornography," etc., and get my sim's axed from search and whatnot; or worse.

That's what you want to do; and believe me, I'm fine with anyone saying no child avs on their sim. Where I'm not fine is if no one who's a child comes in, and we're told we're children and have to leave.

Matisse Vendetta: [...] When the FIRST one comes back -- APOLOGIZE, girl. -- Here's where your subbie skills come in. Yes ma'am and no ma'am 'em all over the place.

I can't, and won't, speak to whatever else was said to Alexie by other people. I can speak to what she said to me, which wasn't apologetic in the least. She was polite, and asked me to change avatars, so points for her; but that was after she bounced me and I came back, so I'm thinking those points subtract again.

Matisse Vendetta: CHILDREN ... CHILDREN ONLY. Midgets, dwarfs, halflings, other "short things" like little cat-things DON'T COUNT. Leave the short people alone .. CHILDREN ... Think "PORN."

Yeah. Massive failure here, which I realize was you telling her things after the fact; but honestly, had she just pointed people to the covenant in IMs or open chat? I wouldn't have made my two posts; you wouldn't be irked at this tiny spate of controversy.

While I will say it seems odd to me as well that Tiny avatars, f'rinstance, would want to be in Adult or nudity-enabled Mature sims, even with that--most actual teens skating in under the SL ToS won't touch Tinies; they're too short. See a Tiny, it's nearly 100% of the time an adult, and generally an adult over 35, on the other side of the screen.

And, just for the record--Tinies are between one and two feet tall. None of us were that short.

THEM: yeh well we have one that keeps coming in and she is supposed to be a china dolll -- she looks like a kid MAttise -- Mattise its NOT a china dol its a kidd – its serious -- This lot are taking the piss -- you have two people here and both are kid avis

I'll grant you she may have felt attacked at this point? I didn't have voice on (I don't usually) so I can't speak to whatever was said in voice, but none of us were in child avatars. Period.

Emilly Orr said...

Alexia,

I'm still trying to parse that a store model has EM powers, because I come from places where EMs are trusted completely to act in the absent sim owner's stead, and it doesn't sound like you had that trust at the time...So that's confusing for me, I'll work on it.

For everything else:

Dakkar came on in the first place causing problems and upset a customer. THIS I have not even mentioned to Mattise.

It's "Drakkar", and that is EXACTLY the kind of thing Matisse needs to know! That should have been notecarded! Forget who's a child av and who's not; step back and look at what you just said!

Someone came in to your sim and upset a customer. Why the hell didn't you tell Matisse that? Man, that just makes me question your judgement more.

Then, he started changing his avatar into everything BUT mer.

If anyone had been told we had to be mer when we came in--which none of us were--I really think we would have complied. We weren't. (And it's not in the covenant, btw, that we have to be.)

However, the appearence of a Bish, looks like an under age kid. The face, stature would quite easily be identified as a teenage boy around 14.

So, we need to figure out what are your guidelines and limitations, don't we? What defines a "child avatar"? If the definition is the legal one:

n., pl., chil·dren (chĭl'drən).
1. a. A person between birth and puberty.
b. A person who has not attained maturity or the age of legal majority.
c. An unborn infant; a fetus.
d. An infant; a baby.


If we're going by Second Life's definition:

Quite simply, a child avatar is any avatar that attempts to present as a youth. This is not limited to humans, and can include furries (referred to in this instance as "cubs" or "babyfur"), neko, vampires, and other avatar selections. Some doll avatars might also fit in this category.

This does not necessarily include fairies (which may be child-like in appearance, as well as smaller than the average avatar), tinies (although human baby-shaped tinies do exist), or those wearing gothic lolita and/or cosplay fashions and styles.


We've been disputing the doll thing for years now, but even with dolls in the mix--those are doll avatars specifically designed to appear as children. None of us were.

Emilly Orr said...

(felt I needed to split the comment, it was getting long)

I understand this is a Japanese thing, however, he did NOT have a Japense face to even pass and this sim is not a Japanese theme either.

So...only Japanese sims can have Japanese avatars? And bish avatars can only be Japanese, not Western? Gosh, I'll just run off and tell everyone that.

You say Saori was a china doll? well, china dolls ususally do look like dolls not 3 year olds with blond bunches and a childs dress and less than half size.

She didn't look like a three-year-old, Alexia.

If you are guests on a sim, you respect their rules end of.
Anything less is bad manners.


I wasn't in voice; I didn't hear what went on. I also didn't catch Drakkar being confrontative, though I did note Saori and Jakkar were being hostile at one point (and that bit of conversation is on this blog). And I will grant you, as guests on a sim not ours, we should be polite and respectful.

But many of us were bounced to the sim edge without a single word; this tends to irk people. And when we asked why, many of us weren't told anything but "you look like kids" or some variety thereof. NO ONE--and the chat logs back this up, Alexia!--was told anything about the covenant hosting all the sim rules--WE had to find that on our own!

We can't respect sim guidelines if we don't friggin' know what they ARE!

Dakker, and Saori were the only ones to be removed and only when they chose to wear the avatars which where unaceptable.

Not true. Drakkar, Saori, ME--who you IMed AFTER you bounced me, so you really SHOULD remember!--and Jakkar, by my count. There might have been others.

Also I did NOT throw anyone else off; So that is a lie saying you where.

Yeah...so maybe you just need a soothing cuppa tea and a lie-down for two or three weeks, until you recover your memory? Read up. You bounced at least four of us.

When It was explained that the sim was a no top sim, one of you said well, I'll take my money where it's wanted. You then all preoceded to take the freebies.
The sim is a none top one, except the shopping area which is explain.


Right, save that you told Matisse you told someone that the shopping area was topless as well. (Which is frankly just stupid, but hey, not my sim.) And, while I can't speak for anyone else, I took the free offering in one vendor space because their lucky chair hit my letter. That was when I intended to come back.

But, just so I have this clear--so now, it's not that we apparently showed up as a variety of species and dolls and confusing non-Japanese young people, but that we took freebies that were set out? Aren't free items set out to increase word of mouth, to get people to try products, and maybe come back and spend money?

Or am I misinterpreting again? Are freebies there only for group members (in which case, y'all need to drop a group-only script in)?

Emilly Orr said...

..and wau, on reading back, Alexia's tenuous grasp of (at least typed) English managed to confuse me!

So for the record, the two male avatars (that I know were there) were:

Jakkar Carlos
Drakon Lameth

NEITHER IS NAMED DRAKER OR DAKKAR.

My apologies to the gentlemen in question; my only excuse is that I went with her lead, and her lead was WAY wrong.

Matisse Vendetta said...

Yeah. You should probably be a bit more "openly expressive" in RL, kiddo. But you make a good read.

See ya.

Sphynx Soleil said...

Wau.... when the shopkeepers are that bad, how do you define the griefers?

Emilly Orr said...

Who knows?

But apparently, we're back in 2006, and I think that's the big reason this is getting to me, and I'm having to work on letting it go. If I'm not seven feet tall, that doesn't mean I'm a child. If I'm furred that doesn't mean I'm a child. If I'm a doll that doesn't mean I'm a child.

Just bugs me.

Sphynx Soleil said...

Some people just never grow up, I guess. I suspect the shopkeeper came along just to push your buttons, from xir's comments it doesn't seem like xie was actually engaged, much less cared.

The original idea is good, I think: Just never go back there again.

Emilly Orr said...

I don't intend to.

And I really doubt Vendetta cared at all, he was just briefly amused for the moment, and that moment's passed. I suspect he thinks he won; me, I think we both lost, overall. And that still leaves him with the problems he himself is mandating:

1. How he words escorting as a commercial enterprise, after stating that sex is an activity that can happen anywhere, pretty much guarantees that sooner or later, someone's going to wake up and want him to classify as Adult. Right now his sims are Mature. This is a huge problem just waiting for the wrong set of eyes.

2. The fact that every member of Haven of Rogues has eject powers. That still just staggers me. I suppose, if it's more akin to a friends' group, and he knows and trusts everyone in there to act in his stead--but then we get a situation like this one, where Alexia did the wrong thing, followed by the wrong thing, followed by the wrong thing, followed by the wrong thing. Maybe that doesn't happen often, but I'd be surprised if I was the first one it happened to.